Author Topic: Guava Fleet  (Read 6117 times)

FingerTech

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2015, 02:26:58 am »
I don't think getting pushed out should change aggression.  The way I see it, a multibot's advantage is that it can still have constant aggression even if one bot spends the whole match running away, as long as the other is attacking.  Or they can trade off attacking.  Still constant.
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GuavaMoment

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2018, 10:44:22 pm »
Even though we really don't use this forum anymore, I REALLY don't like using facebook for this, so let's do the Kilobots 40 recap here!

MangoMinute was a small speedy wedge I made in a few weekends out of robot stuff I had just sitting around. Used 16 year old escaps for drive, banebots 3-9 ESCs and two (mismatched) 3s cells to run on 6s. The BEC is rated for 24mA at 6S and the rxer seems to need about 22mA. It's fine! :) It used blue spring steel for a front wedge and had a big magnet in the front. I could get onto my wheel from any position on the robot just by driving, including the position where the wheels weren't touching the ground. The robot is so fast as to be nearly uncontrollable, and doesn't go in a straight line very well.

MangoMinute vs Metroid
Metroid is obviously a very good bot, and I think I was holding my own against it pretty well. From what I remember I could get under him, sort of, and was able to take a few hits without immediately exploding. Unfortunately, after one of the hits I see the power LED is out, and I get KOd. What happened was when I last charged the batteries I didn't take off the right panel due to laziness, and didn't connect the JST cables as securely as I could have. I figured one of those popped out, and sure enough that was the problem.

MangoMinute vs MegaLondon
I don't remember much here. Megalondon is a small Limblifter essentially, and I think Megalondon got me on top of him twice, and on the second one was able to take me to the pushout. 0-2, out of the tournament.

MangoMinute vs The Snip
I said I'd be willing to grudge anyone and meant it, but I was a little disappointed another ant wanted to fight. I'd have fought a beetle! The Snip has this cute little cutting disk, which I thought might make some nice sparks, or flip me over a few times. Turns out The Snip is a ferocious beast and literally cut chunks of of the hardened armor. Broke off a motor shaft too. At one point I was pinned against a wall while The Snip was grinding away at the 1/16" garolite that was only thing between the disk and a battery. It never got all the way through, and I tapped out once one hit had me land in the middle of the arena with wires sticking out. It was only the power LED (I never trimmed those wires) but I was getting worried about lipo fires if we kept going. Damn, The Snip has a scary weapon!

Rumble
I tape a tire back on the broken wheel and crab walk during the rumble. I don't know who did it, and I haven't done a full teardown, but the working escap motor has separated from the gearbox inside the robot, so let's assume that motor is dead too.


Limblifter vs Mega Don G
Mega Don G has a bunch of long feeler fork wedges on for this fight, so I try to get to the side of him and hope for a lift and flip. I do get to his side, but when I try to lift him, stuff isn't working right. Is he using a lot of magnets? Am I breaking more gears inside my lifting motor? I somehow end up upside down with the lifting arm behind me, and it's certainly broken now, it won't move. This is a huge stroke of luck, because it broke in a position where if I assume the lifting arm tip is the front, everything drives like it should and I'm just a normal wedge. I get Mega Don G to a pushout, but drive both of us out. We reset, and I'm able to repeat the process but stay in the arena. Win by pushout. I replace the last stage of gears on the lifting gearbox.

Limblifter vs Reckoning
For the first time I have modular lifting arms. I'm able to easily remove arms and add other things, and not have them fall off under the first hit. I knew I needed something to deal with all the powerful drum bots infesting the brackets. I saw a few weeks ago the wolverine claws that botkits are selling. It's just a hardened S7 claw on a hinge, and $99. I can do cheaper than that! The simplest source of hardened metal I know of would be some random chisel at Canadian tire. All I have to do is attempt to drill two holes in that, fashion a hinge for it, and I'm good to go! It's not that difficult to drill into FYI. I started with a cobalt 1/8" bit, and worked up 1/32" (or even 1/64") at a time until I got to 1/4". For the fight I have my chisel on the front, and one lifting arm on the side.

For the first minute of the fight, things are going really well! The chisel's holding up and Reckoning is taking the worst of the collisions. For the wide drums like him, it's really easy to aim the chisel into the drum. Brandon tells me afterward that he was getting very nervous during the fight because things were going badly for him. I notice the lifting arm is broken again. I get upside down on top of Reckoning at some point. Normally I'd flip myself out of situations like that, but with no working arm, I have to drive off. This caused my KO. A wheel must have been on the drum, and gets shaved off to the point where it's under the frame. When I slide off Reckoning, a combination of drum damage, broken lifting arm and lack of a wheel prevent all the other wheels from touching the ground enough to prevent a KO, and I get counted out. The chisel sustained almost no damage. Brandon showed me the drum, and it got mangled. He said I did more damage to the drum than anyone else in the tournament (and he fought Utopia!) and gave me a mangled tooth as a trophy. We all learned a lesson here - drums hate it when you shove a chisel down their throat.

Limblifter vs Exercise Restraint
I stay with the chisel. The lifting arm gets broken again. The chisel front wedge was made hastily and was too low, but I fixed it so I was driving a little better this fight than against Reckoning. ER ate a little bit of chisel and then drove itself out the pushout. I knew it had been having technical problems, but I thought it all got fixed before our fight. I later learned they had some transmitter setting wrong, either the weapon wasn't at full power, or was at full power preventing them from driving right, something like that. I'll take a lucky win though!

Limblifter vs LowBlow
I had a plan for wedges, vertical spinners and drums. I had no plan for horizontal spinners, and now I have to fight one. LowBlow is very easy to get under, so I go for standard lifting arm setup. After the last two fights though, the lifting arm is so mangled that doesn't connect the way it should. I have to back out a bunch of screws to give the arm constant play so that it rotates the full 360. I was shocked this didn't bite me in the ass. During the fight I'm able to have the main front wedge take a hit or two without exploding, so I just kept going after his weapon. LowBlow gets on top of me a couple of times, blade just millimeters away from tires and the top panel and other squishy parts. The lifting arm kind of breaks again, so I stop using it. A fight like this isn't one you win, it's one you outlast, and let the opponent defeat himself. And that's what happened. LowBlow hits me or the wall or something and goes straight out the pushout. I do a victory dance and see the lifting arm still kind of works. I discover once the fight ends that I wasn't breathing, or something. The only other fight I've ever had which was more stressful was DMR vs Hellrazer at the Joe Dogs event.

One of the hits pushed a side panel into a tire. I fix it, but the motor it connects to feels weird. It's a lot harder to turn. It doesn't sound crunchy, and works fine when powered, so I just go with it. I have no replacement anyway. I replace the entire lifting gearbox this time with the only remaining one that works and hasn't been harvested for gears.

Limblifter vs Wilson
The Battle of Edmonton! Sadly the winner of this fight was LowBlow. The weird motor totally died in this fight, and since the sides are in parallel off one ESC, it disabled its mate. Wilson's drum is narrower and slower, so the chisel strat didn't work. I break the lifting gearbox again. Pierre was nice enough to keep attacking me to prevent a KO, but I obviously lose the decision.

Rumble
I remove the bad gearbox, and the shaft of the lifting gearbox. So I'm just a three wheeled wedge. I obviously didn't do much the entire rumble, but I did absorb all the hits I needed to, and was one of the few (two?) left working at the end, along with Wilson who clearly won the rumble. Limblifter finished 3-2, in a tie for 5th place, and didn't put in an Angle Grinder of Doom worthy falling apart incident. A marked improvement over the 2015 event!

What went right
- 2.4GHz radio systems! I had zero radio issues, for the first time in what seems like forever.
-Snap hubs! I shoo goo the snap rings in place (something I do not see enough people doing) and had no problems. They worked better than my official and/or homemade Dave's hubs.
-Modular lifting arms made of 1/2" Al bar. This was the first event I didn't have an arm ripped off, or mangled so horribly there was no way it was going to work again. Some of the bars got bent a little, but that's fine. It used to be such an enormous pain in the ass to remove the arm I didn't want to do it ever. I did it after every fight here.
-Dear God the chisel. That is a winning idea we're going to see more of in the future.
-This is the first event where I feel like I don't need to rebuild the entire frame over from scratch! Unless I need a redesign, see below.

What went wrong
-I have no working lifting gearmotors, as Banebots doesn't make them anymore. Limblifter (and Papillion, lol) broke all five! I see Robotshop has some potential replacements maybe? That I'd have to make a new design around again, grrrr.
-I need more clearance between the side rails and the wheels. I wish 2024 wasn't so hard to find because that alone would help the problem. I'm sure the kitbots motor would have held up if it wasn't stalled. I need to buy some replacements, too.
-I could use better traction.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2018, 10:45:59 pm by GuavaMoment »

Travis7s

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2018, 11:46:18 pm »
Mango Minute could have fought Dempsy Roll who was itching for a grudge!

Speaking of drilling chisels...what did you use to drill the blue steel? I've been using little carbide center drills to do the pilot, and once you have that it doesn't seem so bad. Also I have found that masonry bits with the carbide are cheap and pretty effective albeit not pretty.

Always good to see Limblifter, even though this one is new it still has that nostalgic feel to it. I'm thinking you almost need to indrectly drive the arm with a belt or chain these days with all the murderers in the beelte class.

What radio system are you using?


GuavaMoment

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2018, 12:24:32 am »
The secret to drill blue steel is to not drill it. I use this.

I'm using the cheapo radio system Kurtis sells. It has no features I'm used to, but it worked!

Travis7s

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2018, 01:05:19 am »
Nice, I had all my blue steel waterjet for this event anyways!

Ah yes, the T6A. Those worked amazing well for the price if you don't mind the lack of receiver options and on board programming. We even used them on Crash n Burn.

FingerTech

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2018, 02:45:53 pm »
Gluing the snap rings in place?  And that isn't a pain in the butt when you need to change a tire?

NightWing would have definitely fought MangoMinute.  We need a grudge sign-up sheet next time for people to see who is available!
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GuavaMoment

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2018, 07:23:40 pm »
I'm not gluing the snap rings exactly, I shoo goo them in. It's an adhesive/sealant. It's certainly possible to peel all that goo off and replace; I did it after the Reckoning fight and it only added about a minute to the process.

Travis7s

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2018, 09:03:41 pm »
Probably the same thing as Shoe Goo but I used Goop II to mount my maxons in both Blue Steel and Troubleshooter and it is strong yet quite easy to remove.

Mattiator

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2018, 07:24:13 pm »
RE: The Limblifter/ER fight, I had forgotten to switch down to low-speed settings (had it cranked up for Treadnought earlier IIRC), so the drive was constantly tripping the failsafe on the ESCs whenever it tried to move. I also had a bad ESC on the left side (the label said it didn't have a tapbrake, dammit) so only one side was responding correctly. When you flipped me I saw I was rolling towards the pit, so instinctively I mashed backwards... which drove me straight in. Literally was the first time I'd actually had to drive one of my robots in upside-down. I'll get you next time.

GuavaMoment

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Re: Guava Fleet
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2019, 11:37:38 pm »
Kilobots 43! Old Man Guava still prefers dead forums to facebook!

At the event I'm installing a new pulley on ORIGIN since it was having problems not spinning up, and melting wires in the process. Dirk comes over and tells me Limblifter fights LowBlow first, and ORIGIN fights Chaos Theory. I'm like 60% sure he's joking because of the history LL/LB had a year ago, and because out of all beetleweights that have ever existed, Chaos Theory would be like top 5 in robots I would least want to fight with ORIGIN. I was even trolling Dirk on facebook about him not having it ready to fight me in a sarcastic mocking tone.

Limblifter vs LowBlow
So for a fight like this there's not much point in trying to flip over LowBlow, as it would just hit you in pretty much the same place. The only real strategy is to drive straight at it, absorbing blows until someone breaks, or I can push him into a wall or pushout. Maybe try jamming the lifting arms into the weapon in the hope of hitting the belt? I didn't really want to test out the improved alloy aluminum arms this early in the competition, but I was ok testing the improved alloy aluminum front wedge! So I spend 2 minutes 57 seconds bashing my face into LowBlow's blade. He did not break himself, or fly out of the arena so there wasn't much I could do. A rear section of armor was ripped off and the wheel it was protecting fell off (set screw issue) but none of that was a real problem. On the final hit I die for some reason; I see the power LED is off. I look up at the clock and see 2:57 and enjoy the small victory that this fight wasn't a KO. Not much you can do if LowBlow is working. Loss by JD.

I'm not sure why exactly everything died since all I found inside was one unsoldered wire powering one half the drive. Maybe the power switch bolt vibrated out? For the first time this competition I was using loctite on all the screws I could and to be honest it did nothing. I had to re-torque all the bolts like I usually do after matches, and I still had one wheel fall off. Lowblow took apart pretty much everything yet damaged almost nothing fortunately. The main support holding the lifting motor gearbox did break in half which was permanently going to expose one wheel, but everything else was easily fixable. Nothing much was very bent, so small victory there.

ORIGIN vs Chaos Theory
This fight could have gone so badly. The only hope here was to get at Chaos Theory's right side and hope to slice off the belt before it does too much damage to me. His weapon has more reach so whatever I do, I needed to do it quick. While the weapon worked in testing, it does not start when the fight starts. In a panic I can only think to jam the stationary weapon into his belt. I see a belt come off after the first big hit. It looks like a very big long belt? That's not mine! The announcer proclaims that it's ORIGIN's belt and that my weapon won't be working anymore, and well, he's half right. On the first hit Chaos Theory hit my weapon pulley and belt, but had his come off first. Just from inertia the blade manages one more cut on the left side pod, but then his weapon stops spinning. So now what? Pushing match between the two least pushy bots ever? Chaos Theory wins the first push and jams my rear carbon fiber support under the big blue saw hazard. I was really worried I was going to be stuck there without the drive power to escape, but when Dirk let off I was able to drive out easily. A drive motor or one of its supports on Chaos Theory then falls off or something! This is now a winnable fight! Then the robot Gods smiled upon me - THE WEAPON SPINS UP! I had been trying every few seconds in the hope that something would happen and my prayers were answered. I see that the spinning weapon is aimed directly at his brushless weapon motor. Full power forward! Dirk taps out! Victory dance time! I literally can't remember the last time I made someone tap out, if ever. I made a nick on his weapon motor but didn't break it.

The only notable damage to me was on the first hit. With me aiming to try to hit his belt, it meant his weapon could hit my belt. About 80% of the belt was cut through and a little damage done to the pulley, but not enough to prevent it from working. I can't believe the weapon spun up with just that sliver of belt. I had to replace the stabilizer shaft that broke under the big blue saw, but I was prepared to do that a lot.

ORIGIN vs Reckoning
It's very comforting going into battle against Reckoning knowing I won't get totally destroyed. Match starts, and weapon doesn't spin up. Great. Reckoning beats me up for like a minute, getting some good tosses in. All power goes out and I'm KOd.

All that happened was the main power connector came loose. Whoops, easy fix! Also the battery was swollen to twice its size, so I throw that in the sandbox and write it off. The tires got a little chewed up but not enough that I'd want to replace them, and that's a major victory for the design of ORIGIN right there. The drive shafts all appeared to survive the beating too; I'm pretty sure I landed directly on one at one point. As for the weapon, it was like two hours later when I realized that the weapon shuddered like one of the three phases wasn't working? I check the ESC and yeah, one of the pads came unsoldered. I fix it and hook the ESC up to Limblifter's spare brushless motor gearbox, and find it only shudders and a little smoke comes out of the motor. I assume the ESC is no good anymore. I have some spare Chinese reversible 30A ESCs that never worked at all before, but maybe with the new pulley it'll work? I solder in the new ESC, go to the box and IT WORKS. IT SPINS BOTH WAYS. I had been using the stock Fingertech 20A ESC before which only spun one way. Perhaps there is hope!

Icky Mouse had been lost in a luggage fiasco and I was kinda hoping it would stay that way so I could fight Pardon My French. A robot that can't hit a target over 3", and has an exposed brushless motor and ESC on top. That would have been a fun fight. But Icky Mouse arrived, won, and gets to fight me next.

ORIGIN vs Icky Mouse
Icky Mouse is a scary drum spinner but I'm the perfect design to avoid getting damaged by it. The problem is his weapon spins faster than mine, and is harder than mine (S7 vs Ti). I will not win a traditional weapon on weapon hit. The only hope is to spin down and go for one giant interlocking hit. I'll go flying after hitting him spinning that way, but maybe he'll break first? It'll be cool either way. I forgot which stick direction was down though. Before the fight I test the stick, and no, that's traditional spinning. I move the stick the other way and it spins downward. Great! It's working. Travis tells me I did that with the other door still open. Sorry! I thought I saw David close it but he reopened it to test something, and I didn't see that.  So the fight starts - and the weapon doesn't spin up. Frustrating to say the least! What do I do now? I aim my dead weapon at him which makes some nice ping sounds. I don't know how this happened exactly, but a drive shaft broke and a wheel fell off. Unseen damage from the Reckoning fight maybe? Either way, that's a tap out, and the knowledge that I need to use metal shafts for drive in the future. A loss you learn from is a good one.

Limblifter vs Kelpie
Kelpie is a pneumatic flipper. Really cool accomplishment for a beetle, but I kind of think it won't be too effective. I know I can win the ground clearance game, and flip him over a bunch. I got this. I'm using the 30A reversible ESCs on the lifting motor, and boy do I wish it had a brake feature. It's much more difficult to get the arm exactly where I need it to be after a failed lift attempt. You're lucky if you have one second to position your lifting arm without getting pushed around, and with the current setup it can take more than that. And my arm isn't as fast as it used to be. What this means is that I have a hard time getting under Kelpie. He flips me once and I recover. He flips me again right beside the closed pushout, and I get a little too cocky with what happens next. I want to flip over in a way then when I'm righted, the arm faces forward. I can flip over the other way but then the arm needs to go 180 degrees more to face forward. I go for the former method, and almost somersault myself of out the arena. I'm in a precarious position I think I can fix, but Kelpie comes and tosses me out before I'm able to. Whoops! At least I'm good to go for the rumble. I do get stuck in the arena so badly Kurtis has to get in the arena to free me. My girlfriend takes a good picture of his butt.

Rumble
I'm beside Pardon My French who I really, really want to flip over since I couldn't break him with ORIGIN. Then the plan was to go after Wilson since we have beef we need to settle. ;) I get under PMF and I'm pushing him around when Reckoning shows up out of nowhere and just nails me. I go flying out the pushout. First eliminated. That one hit bent my super alloy front wedge and like 80% ripped it out. Holy f$*%.

0-2 Limblifter is the worst I've ever done since debuting with it. I don't know where to go from here exactly. I though I had super tough armor and got wrecked twice. The lifter (which didn't break at least) is now too slow and uncontrollable. It might be time to retire it and try something new.

1-2 ORIGIN is coming back, but needs some work. New, more powerful weapon motor (which actually should save me like 10 grams), new customizable ESC, and metal drive shafts. I'm considering moving the whole weapon forward a few inches so I can hit things that don't fit between the wheels. I'm considering going down a 3D printing rabbit hole to print out the frame. I was really happy with the drive and the durability of the wheels, so I have a solid foundation to work from. Just need to get that weapon spinning! I also was voted Coolest Beetle and won some ESCs I could use in a 12lb bot. Not bad! I was hoping I could win either Coolest Beetle or Best Design. I voted The Butcher and Kelpie respectively, and I was pretty happy to hear that the other builders overwhelmingly also voted Kelpie as best design. I certainly underestimated Kelpie and was glad to see it win an award!